Coach Tom (00:01.698)
Hey Kenny, how are you?

Kenny Bailey (00:03.163)
I am Fantastic Tom, how are you?

Coach Tom (00:05.01)
I'm fantastic as well. have Karelle Laurent back with us to talk nutrition today. So Correll, welcome back. Karelle is a registered nutrition therapist who specializes in sports nutrition, excuse me, which is right up our alley because that's what we like to talk about. And we've got lots of questions. I want to cover some training time of the year. We've got protein questions. We've got weight loss. I've got so many questions for your Karelle.

Kenny Bailey (00:12.712)
Welcome.

Coach Tom (00:34.408)
So excited to have you back on. Karelle's out in Portugal, which you have to check out her website and go to one of her riding camps, which my wife, Wendy and I are gonna do the end of this year. We're very excited about that. A little business first, please subscribe. Thumbs up, five stars, do all that stuff, subscribe so you make sure you get on all of this stuff. So we wanna make sure you get this around to everybody. So Karelle, welcome, welcome.

Karelle (00:34.796)
you

Kenny Bailey (00:44.104)
Hello.

Karelle (01:02.4)
Hi everyone and hi Kenny. Thank you for having me, Kenny and Tom. Thanks for having me again. I'm really excited about everything today. And yeah.

Kenny Bailey (01:08.776)
Of course.

Coach Tom (01:11.224)
Yes. It's good. It's good. let's talk about, let's start off with the time of the year, right? This is April, this is spring, this is the start of the triathlon and endurance seasons. And a lot of people that I'm seeing and athletes I'm talking with are all in this, like I put on a little weight in the winter, know, I didn't eat right, didn't train very hard, didn't do all this stuff. And now we're kind of getting into this pattern where I need to start training. I have races coming up.

and I wanna lose a little weight. And that steps into this whole scary thing of trying to lose weight while you're training for a race. And is that a good idea or not? And how do you do that? I mean, that's probably the first of many questions that leads off.

Karelle (02:00.896)
Yeah, so let me start with it's yes, losing weight as a perspective of being an athlete is often part of the big the picture because it helps us go faster. It helps us to increase the watts and it's a legitimate goal as part of the training program. However, we need to be very, very careful about that. And it's often

A planning question is when do we start to think about that topic and when do we start to think about our body composition in a point of view of a racing that will go down to when is your race time and ideally

in a very polite way. We had a bit of a chat before. But in a very polite way, always try to say, focus on the goal that you have. When is your race? What is your goal? What is your purpose when you do your training? Is your training increasing your performance in order to go to... What is your goal with your race? Are you trying to cross the line? Are you trying to beat your time? Are you trying to be on the podium? Are you trying to beat your age group? And that all comes down to that.

Coach Tom (02:44.993)
Yeah

Karelle (03:12.624)
So then in order to achieve that, you need to start early, as early as possible, in good preparation. So when you start your training, you start your training with an...

the right body composition or at least you approaching that right body composition. Because if you are starting and thinking I'm gonna cut down calories that's going to slow down your recovery, it's going to impair your absorption of nutrients, it potentially can be dangerous in a point of view of your performance as well.

And mentally, it can be quite negative into your accomplishment for your training. So if you have your hours of training and you're not feeling sufficiently, the reality is after a few weeks, you start to cut down a session or two, and then mentally it's hard to finish the session, then you're not progressing the same way. So I can see you smile Tom, so I'm speaking.

Coach Tom (04:06.605)
It's a brutal cycle that people kind of get into when it's not working. You plateau really quickly to that point. And I think it's, want to say that adding some weight, having some weight fluctuations throughout the year at the end of the season, I think is healthy. I think it's very healthy for you not to try to stay as lean as possible all year round. But I think I'm trying to get athletes to think more about when they put their big goals on.

Kenny Bailey (04:07.835)
Yeah.

Karelle (04:15.456)
Yeah.

Karelle (04:25.955)
very.

Coach Tom (04:35.617)
to put them further out, like a year or two years out or three years out and then aim for that because I think the ramp up will be a little bit more consistent. You'll be able to eat more consistently throughout the year and then not do big swings in weight change. A moderate few pounds is fine. It's natural. It's healthy. But trying to cut down a lot of weight, trying to take 20 pounds off before your race is very unhealthy, as you mentioned.

Karelle (05:05.87)
And you don't know how you're going to cope with that. don't know. now is that that weight has been an excessive weight because you were, you know, in the indulgent period and you've been having a little bit more, you know, family time eating food and that's okay. That fluctuation is natural. And I agree with you, Tom. Now, if you just say to yourself, I've got so I'm a kilogram, but you just...

Coach Tom (05:08.683)
Yes.

Coach Tom (05:31.905)
That's fine, we can do the math.

Kenny Bailey (05:32.071)
We'll do the conversions down below.

Karelle (05:34.05)
But if you say, I need to lose 10 or 15 kilos because I have a race in three months, how is that going to impair your performance? Is there any marginal gain in losing that weight? Now take it in the point of view as well. We have a very biased view of ourselves as athletes when we are competing because you are in this incredible light crowd. We all want to have this body composition.

Coach Tom (05:59.671)
Yeah.

Karelle (06:00.908)
have clients who want to lose weight at any time in their, you know, at any weight they have. We all have that. So it doesn't really, it's almost your personal goal of losing weight. I would never say to someone you shouldn't or you should, but then there is a moment where is this impacting your performance? Is this impacting your recovery? It's really, it's a really fine line. Now I would often say,

Coach Tom (06:16.674)
Totally.

Karelle (06:30.318)
The big mistake that I see is cutting down calories and we need to just address that because often I see clients cutting down calories, implementing fasting when they're training. When I say when they're training, it's not off season. You can do a little bit of fasting when you're on off season and you do a little bit of a maintenance. But when we're talking about that build up period, we are in April.

We have a lot of in the calendar, end of April, May, June, right? So we're talking about these athletes. Having a calorie deficit now can be detrimental into a lot of aspects on the body system, on your energy production, on your recovery. And it may not benefit the weight loss at all. And sometimes I see that there is no result in the weight loss because your body's into stress. So it's holding on to everything.

Coach Tom (07:08.151)
Hmm.

Coach Tom (07:20.076)
Yeah.

Karelle (07:25.358)
And I have sometimes clients that come and see me and they're like, I don't understand. I keep putting on weight, but I'm cutting down, cutting down, cutting down. What am I doing wrong? And when we're switching and I often say, now I need you to eat then, then, then. And they're like, are you joking? I'm coming to see you to lose weight and you're asking me to eat more. And then they come back for a week. I don't understand. I've lost weight. What is happening? Yeah.

Coach Tom (07:39.765)
Yeah

Kenny Bailey (07:41.244)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (07:46.699)
Yes. It's what is happening here. Yes, yes.

Kenny Bailey (07:48.29)
Yeah, I think there's a, it seems like there's a, there's a difference between, know, I'm eating during the off season and I'm fueling during my training, right? Where the trigger for me anyway, switches from I was eating, now I'm fueling, right? Which is a different sort of mindset to try to get into, which is I'm not trying to lessen the calories. I'm trying to alter what I'm eating. And then you were adding like, so the other, you know, the follow-up question is when you start adding supplements and other things, right? So now you're adding.

Karelle (08:06.435)
Mm.

Karelle (08:18.124)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (08:18.471)
you're trying to increase, you're increasing the amount of gel packs you're eating or the different types of food you're eating because you're in the middle of training, but it feels like it should be fueling rather than training.

Karelle (08:31.374)
You're right, you're right Kenny. And when I work with athletes, the way I usually start to work is we gonna work like in the form of a pyramid if you want. And I'm first going to always utilize the same type of a narrative is we optimizing body composition, but throughout whole food and throughout the during the day, all the meals. So we look at the meals as generally as a general person, as a normal person as we say.

Coach Tom (08:57.515)
as a normal person.

Kenny Bailey (08:57.723)
Yeah.

Karelle (09:01.07)
And I look at that and then after we bring the focus of the fueling and that's the proper... But we tend to forget sometimes as athletes that you have a life outside of training. We're not pro athletes and the big difference with pro athletes and age groupers would be that you are training, the volume is intense, but during the day you have a job. So you can be a nurse in the hospital, you can be a teacher.

You can be a general manager and running around everywhere. You can be a coach or you can be very sedentary, but the amount of calories you're utilizing during the day is really important. So that's why we start first by supporting the body function and then we're supporting your particular training with your feeling. Exactly. I like that you are using these words because we tend to do one or the other. We tend to forget. And when we're cutting down calories,

Kenny Bailey (09:32.039)
Dang it.

Karelle (09:58.242)
We're cutting down from both.

Kenny Bailey (09:58.312)
It's a good point.

Kenny Bailey (10:02.191)
Interesting.

Coach Tom (10:02.561)
Yes, and that's the killer right there. That's what, I don't think we realize, we understand how much cortisol affects our body's stress system and hormones as soon as you're in life stress and trying to ramp up your training stress and then cutting calories on this thing that throws your body into complete turmoil. It's amazing what it does. The body's amazing, but how it responds to stress is crazy.

Karelle (10:06.766)
That's the feeling.

Karelle (10:11.918)
so much.

Karelle (10:21.571)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (10:24.357)
Well, there's also a challenge is there's an optimal weight, power to weight ratio kind of counts, right? So there's a try to lose weight to lose weight to look good in Lycra. Yeah, you always gotta look good in Lycra. But.

Coach Tom (10:39.159)
Ha ha.

Karelle (10:39.969)
Always gonna look the like.

Kenny Bailey (10:40.807)
You know, if you're too light, you may start sacrificing power, right? Because there's that balance between how much weight, know, personally, how much weight do I need to have when I'm at a certain weight? I know I'm light enough where I feel like I can run effectively, but I still have enough power on the bike to turn the cranks, or if I'm five, six pounds, if I'm trying to get more light.

six pounds longer, my watts go down too. So it's not just a, lose a bunch of weight, you're gonna do better. It's weight to the point where you're the most effective in your race, right? I guess, is that the?

Karelle (11:16.814)
And you're right Kenny, but then that's where it comes down to such a difference, a personal level, because we're not all losing weight the same way. You're gonna have the ideal way where you're gonna lose fat. That's great. That's what everybody wants, right? But it's not always as simple as that. And depending on how you are reducing your calorie or what is your eating pattern, your feuding pattern,

Coach Tom (11:34.093)
you

Karelle (11:45.454)
or what type of food groups you are reducing or your stress level. There's so many things that are coming into play. If you are male or female, what age group you have, not necessarily as a category of a racing age group, but if you're 20 or if you're 45, it's going to be a different adaptation to the burning of your body composition. The problem is often we are not burning the fat.

we are just losing our weight as more general, we're losing muscle mass, we're losing because what I often see is I'm going to have athletes going to a training session in the morning, they've fasted, they haven't been feeling very well the day before, what is happening then? They're burning muscle. So my question is always, okay, you do 10, 8...

you know 15 hours of training do you see your body composition changing do you see your muscle changing because if you're going to the gym four times a week and if you are running four times a week you should see that change and usually the the answer is no

I don't think I do. Is your what increasing? Not that much because it's the wrong part of the body that you are losing. And it's almost the description that I usually utilize is it's almost like if you go in grocery shopping or you go in Christmas shopping with no money on your bank account and the banker is actually, well, I'm sorry, I'm going to have to take the retirement fund. And that's your muscle. That's what's happening.

Kenny Bailey (12:55.292)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (13:01.547)
Yeah, yeah.

Kenny Bailey (13:01.628)
Yep.

Kenny Bailey (13:12.103)
Sure.

Coach Tom (13:18.637)
Yes. Yeah. Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (13:18.811)
Yeah, meh, meh. Well, I think maybe to take a step back, it feels to me like weight is a secondary measurement, maybe. Like what are the things that you look for? Is it, to your point, is it body fat ratio or what are those things that you look at that you're trying to get people to, besides just weight, I guess?

Karelle (13:43.308)
But to me, I don't look at anything in particular. It's what the client wants me to focus on. When they're coming to see me with a weight goal, I'm going to readjust the food with the output.

Kenny Bailey (13:49.414)
yet.

Uh-huh.

Kenny Bailey (13:56.519)
Okay.

Karelle (13:58.688)
With the day to day, as I was saying, the type of jobs that they have, the demanding of energy that they have, and then the training. then we look at multiple factors. How is your energy level? How is your adaptability in your training? Is your weight part of the equation? Then we can look at that weight changing. But often it comes back with multiple feedback of, I'm feeling so much better, Carrel. I've been going on this super long ride and I felt really sharp and da da da da da.

Kenny Bailey (14:00.55)
Okay.

Karelle (14:28.632)
So the goal often just kind of becomes secondary and you're right, but we need to then address that because if the client's goal is important, that needs to be addressed. But it becomes secondary because they feel better and they train more.

Kenny Bailey (14:46.791)
It's almost like there needs to be a performance goal, not necessarily a weight goal. Whatever performance that is. If my performance is to get across the line and weight is my barrier to get there, if my performance goal is to be faster, it may not be weight, it just may be, to your point, reconfiguring the fuel so that you're more optimum, which may, it's sort of like the Ozempic thing. It was supposed to just cure your health with diabetes and by the way, it does weight loss. It wasn't supposed to be weight loss, right? It's sort of, what's your performance goal? By the way, the secondary benefit

Coach Tom (14:46.827)
Yeah.

Karelle (14:50.304)
often, yeah.

Karelle (15:04.524)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (15:13.654)
Yeah.

Karelle (15:14.062)
Hmm.

Kenny Bailey (15:16.745)
but maybe you're gonna have a better composition and lose weight in the process. Or the same weight, but your muscle to fat ratio is gonna be a lot different, right? Yeah, I mean, and that's...

Karelle (15:20.867)
Yeah.

Karelle (15:26.092)
And often that absolutely happens. Yeah, absolutely.

Coach Tom (15:28.437)
Yeah, I try to I try to get people to focus on fueling properly and not step on the scale. I just like for athletes, especially female athletes, I'm like, like, don't look at weight, because you might gain weight. If you can gain muscle mass, you're gaining weight and they look at the scale and the scale is going up. And I'm like, but look at your body composition is changing muscle. Muscle power is good. And if you're a couple pounds heavier.

Karelle (15:33.389)
Yeah.

Karelle (15:40.682)
It's so hard.

Kenny Bailey (15:42.62)
Yeah.

Karelle (15:50.722)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (15:57.474)
you know, after your training, that's okay because you've got more power, you're building off of it, you're not adding body fat on, but ultimately the body sort of takes care of itself if you fuel it properly. And that's the tricky part, you know? So I try to tell people not to look at that. I don't have the background in nutrition. My just, my looking on the outside just says, look, just don't step on the scale. Just, you know, you can...

Karelle (16:09.581)
Yeah.

That's

Karelle (16:21.974)
Yeah, but that's really hard.

Kenny Bailey (16:22.663)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (16:23.725)
It is, but put that away, focus on your training, focus on eating, eat more, eat more often. And then look at your body composition every once in a while. Don't look at it every day. You're not going to see the small changes. Look at it once a month, set it on the calendar and say, once a month I'm going to look at myself in the mirror and just go like, oh, look, well, it's a muscle. That's pretty cool. Because it will happen naturally that way. But if you stress over it, then it's not going to get you the result you want.

Karelle (16:26.572)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (16:27.653)
Yeah.

Karelle (16:29.965)
Mm.

Kenny Bailey (16:51.983)
Yeah. I mean, we found like with our clients, we try to do 30 day challenges and we found 30 day challenges to be difficult because those challenges, when we put them on a, we have a machine that measures, you know, water, body fat bone at the 30 days, the weight stays relatively the same, but their body composition changes where if we do a 60 day challenge, then they start seeing significant differences. Right? So it's sort of like what that sticky measure.

Karelle (17:05.728)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (17:18.279)
Just a kind of a side question, I've been curious to get you on the call just for this one. There's a bit of, regarding weight or regarding nutrition, we've seen an increase in the amount of athletes, at least at my place, that are starting to use continuous glucose monitors as a weight, not just from a diabetic standpoint, from performance standpoint. And I believe there's two or three companies that are targeting athletes specifically for that. What are your thoughts on that? Let's just start there.

Karelle (17:33.88)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Karelle (17:48.46)
think it's, you know, they're great tools to have. Now you need to know how to use them. That's the reality. sometimes it's true, right? Because it can be quite overwhelming. So let's break it down in two because I think it's worth utilizing. We'll talk about non-diabetic type of person and I often use the, and non-performance for now.

Kenny Bailey (17:54.832)
Yeah, with awesome power, because awesome responsibility. Yeah.

Coach Tom (17:58.967)
Yeah.

Karelle (18:16.43)
I often use the tool in terms of education and helping people to understand when we look at

we do snapshot of pictures of food with clients sometimes. really depends on the clients, but it can happen several times. And we look at the blood glucose monitor, and it's really interesting to see the impact of certain food. And it helps people to understand the impact of certain food. And I do the interpretation, right? And I would explain why this is happening and what happens during the day as well that triggers that blood sugar response.

Because I find that, and why am I doing that in protection with the clients, is that I find that in the past I had clients who said, I put the... But it's horrible, it keeps going up at every meal, and it's normal, it has to go up.

some point you know your blood sugar needs to but we need to understand how far it's going up and why has it gone up is it regular is it throughout the day or is it once or twice in the day and and to which extent so we talk a lot about that and usually clients are really liking when we do this exercise because they start to understand and then we make the link with the performance see that's that's what we don't want during the day but that's what we want in a purventory view of performance because it means that if you are able to elevate

Coach Tom (19:06.017)
Yeah

Karelle (19:35.712)
your blood sugar and keep it elevated you have that support from exogenous glucose right so you take gels and etc that helps you to not have the dip because that's what you don't want to have you don't want that to fall down and it's it helps often I think

Don't get me wrong utilizing the blood glucose monitor for performance is a little bit of an overkill because you can get to that with the timing. It's really rocket science. You really need to get the timing right. that's the point of view of it. And I did many years ago, think that was when I'm not going to tell the brand, was released and I tried it and it's really hard because if you have a heel that it would use all of my glucose and then I would

Kenny Bailey (20:04.625)
Mm-hmm.

Kenny Bailey (20:08.505)
Yeah

Coach Tom (20:08.768)
Yeah.

Karelle (20:26.892)
be too low in terms of the performance so it was a very interesting way to see how that pattern would work on me and it helped me to understand a little bit more as well certain aspect but it's it's

think we're always going to have new technology. The question is how we're going to use that and just utilizing without a purpose, without a goal can be sometimes a little bit, but why? What are you trying to get out of this? It's very educational to use the blood sugar monitor in terms of understanding what we eat.

Kenny Bailey (20:48.903)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (21:05.799)
Yeah, think I was using it, or I was seeing it as sort of a bonk prevention, right? Where it doesn't, does it, and I don't know this, right? I just don't know about it, but it doesn't give you enough of a warning, if you will, ahead of time, knowing that that blood trigger's starting to drop, to say, okay, I'm on the precipice of bonking, I need to, or is it too late? Because by the time it drops, that's what I was thinking too. You got, oh look, this is what a bonk looks like.

Karelle (21:14.892)
Yeah.

Karelle (21:25.582)
I think it's already too late when you see it. I think it's already too late. Yeah, I think it's already too late.

Coach Tom (21:28.737)
Yeah, right.

I see it as more of afterwards, right? Like it's a data to look at after your performance or after your day to see where, I ate this and we spiked and then we dropped and we had the dips. But I don't know if it's at a point yet where it can tell you ahead of time.

Karelle (21:48.12)
So it's a really interesting topic. So when I work with athletes preparing them for races, we are slowly increasing. So usually the way we work is we start eight weeks before race and we slowly increase the...

the fuel in during the session. So there's different aspects of why we're doing that. But we understand this aspect without the data, the geeky data, because what I want them to understand is that drop shouldn't happen.

So if you see it, it's already gone. And why do you see it is that sometimes the delay of the start of the fueling is too late. And particularly, you know when we say, so under an hour, you don't necessarily need to fuel, but over an hour, you start fueling. And I often hear people saying, yeah, start fueling 90 minutes after.

No, you need to start fueling 45 minutes, 30 minutes to 45 minutes in because 90 minutes is the length of that session that you need to start early on. So you will then see that particular person seeing having a dip because they won't have sufficient glycogen storage to go beyond that session. That's it.

Kenny Bailey (23:05.415)
Yeah, that's me. No, I mean, I do the same thing. No, it's almost like you're saying, it's 90 minutes time to start feeling now versus, know, yeah, I know, you're right. Yeah. So, yeah.

Coach Tom (23:06.445)
That's me. That's okay. Yeah.

Coach Tom (23:14.017)
Yeah, yeah. And the absorption, I'm say the absorption, yeah, you're fueling now, but if you're taking direct in like Coke or something, it's 15 minutes before it really, mean roughly 15, 20 minutes before your body starts using that fuel. So a lot of people go right to the bitter end and then they take something in and then they have a huge crash and I don't understand why.

Karelle (23:14.142)
No, you need to start before that. Exactly. And that's why...

Kenny Bailey (23:25.051)
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Karelle (23:31.405)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (23:39.675)
Yeah, or GI issues or...

Karelle (23:40.438)
And the problem is once you start, if you started that fueling strategy too late, you don't have that catch up effect. So that workout on its own is going to be compromised in terms of performance because you already had a delayed start. So if you take the example Kenny of someone who's gonna wear the glucose monitor at that time and understand that dip, he's not gonna learn to do that earlier.

Kenny Bailey (23:50.789)
Yeah.

Karelle (24:07.832)
But he will if he works with me because I'm not a time. Because I'm gonna explain to you what's happening.

Kenny Bailey (24:10.119)
Nice plug there. But yeah, for like a three hour bike ride, for example, you're doing a training ride or a brick and you notice that, okay, it's dipping and you didn't do that. Hopefully it's a teaching tool, not necessarily a race performance tool, right? Would that be a better way to say it?

Coach Tom (24:10.221)
Because Corell will beat it into you.

Karelle (24:19.662)
Yeah.

Karelle (24:30.282)
It's a teaching tool if you are able to do the interpretation. Do you understand when that mistake was made? Yeah. And that's where it's difficult. I really do think that those gadgets or these...

Kenny Bailey (24:36.367)
Yes. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (24:47.877)
I am.

Karelle (24:49.25)
Technology don't necessarily have the interpretation and it's like everything if you do a test and you don't have the interpretation you are not able to understand but why did that happen? So with athletes usually when we do that fueling strategy we increase it slowly until that that race, you know, so ultimately as we build on their performance will increase right and We make mistake and understand talk about it. Yeah

Kenny Bailey (24:58.641)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (25:09.467)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (25:18.359)
Yeah, I think knowing the right questions to ask of the data is critical. It's like you're doing a survey. If you don't know what you want to get out of the survey, you can't ask the right questions. I see it with the heart rate variable, the HRV type stuff. I'm tracking my HRV. It's like, what is it telling you? Well, I don't know. I don't know what do you want it to tell you? What do you want to get out of the data? The glucose monitor, the same thing.

Karelle (25:21.902)
Hmm.

Coach Tom (25:44.716)
What do you want to get out of the data? What is the issue you're trying to solve that you can look at the data in the right way that'll give you the information that you need? And that's why you need a professional like Corel to tell you what you're looking at. I mean, I'm always fascinated with some of that. I would love to try to see, to wear one of those for a couple of weeks, like to see on a day-to-day basis what I eat and how it affects my body for, because people are affected differently by different

Karelle (25:45.251)
Yeah.

Karelle (25:56.59)
Hehehehe

Coach Tom (26:14.903)
carbohydrate type stuff, right? So your blood sugar will spike to different foods to different people will have different reactions to it. It would be fascinating to see that. But I don't do it because I wouldn't know what I'd be looking at. Like, honestly, we just stare at the data and go like, yeah, yeah, what's I don't know what I'm doing with that.

Kenny Bailey (26:27.365)
or how to control the study, right? Yeah, you can, you know, it does this, you don't know which part of that food did that, is it a timing issue, is it a, you know, that kind of thing, right?

Karelle (26:37.358)
And sometimes it's just the same food at two different days and similar time. And you're like, why did that spike and didn't spike here? And that's really interesting. And I had a client, we worked with the blood sugar monitor and there was always the same spiking moment happening. And we tweaked and we tweaked and I was like, what is happening on this day? You know, I was almost like, I don't understand. And I just suddenly out of the blue, I was like.

Kenny Bailey (26:42.159)
Okay. Yeah.

Yeah.

Karelle (27:06.111)
Do you have a meeting always on that? yeah, I a meeting with my boss. And I was like, my God. Okay, we need something to before that meeting. We need to get buffer that stress response because her body and it was her job. maybe that person and the demanding of that meeting would make her blood sugar spike so much.

Coach Tom (27:12.439)
Hahahaha!

Kenny Bailey (27:20.23)
Yeah.

That's hilarious.

You

Coach Tom (27:29.57)
Wow.

Kenny Bailey (27:30.513)
That's funny.

Karelle (27:30.842)
Really? And I couldn't understand. was like, at the beginning I was like, maybe she forgot something, you know, she didn't mention anything that was, you know, on the... But there's a word, I was like, no, no, no, that just, she hasn't forgotten, like, that many times. And it was, was that, that every time she had the meeting. So we did, we added a protein snack and really made a big difference. We tweaked a little bit.

Coach Tom (27:48.737)
So how do you level that out? What do you eat to change that?

Kenny Bailey (27:50.887)
Cool.

Kenny Bailey (27:56.922)
Or you just tell the boss, look, hey, I'm on a training program and you're really spiking my, so what we're gonna do is not meet until after the race. Just so you know, the problem is you, you're the problem. You're the Taylor Swift, the problem is you. So what I'm gonna do is remove that so I can have a nice smooth. So appreciate you, I'll see you in August, exactly.

Karelle (28:01.228)
Hehehehe

Coach Tom (28:02.733)
You

Karelle (28:04.686)
My nutritionist said... Back off.

Coach Tom (28:07.469)
Yeah, yeah, you're the pro.

You're messing with my vibe.

Karelle (28:16.578)
But... It...

It shows that you don't necessarily have an impact on a response only with the food, but with the environment you are in, with your stress response. Your stress response would call a spike of cortisol that is going to send neurotransmitter message, et cetera, it's calling for glucose because in the wild, your stress response is supposed to be you sending all the blood to your muscle and running for your life. Okay, that meeting is...

is not running for your life, but your body doesn't know any difference, so it's behaving the same way. So we implemented a bit of protein, some breath work a little bit in the bathroom before.

Coach Tom (28:55.223)
Wow.

Coach Tom (29:01.714)
Yeah

Karelle (29:02.382)
It really made a big difference but more importantly she was aware she was aware that you know this is a pattern and it has an impact on the rest of the day because once you have that blood sugar spiking the rest of her day is just impacted because you don't have the same choices in terms of food you're gonna go for something more sweet you're gonna go for something more refined so your nice meal with whole food you had prepared

Coach Tom (29:04.961)
No, and you could see it. That's cool.

Karelle (29:32.376)
the day before and you just, you know, it's like, no, I don't want to eat that. So it has a repel effect, right? So it's really important to just try to nurture that stress response and then to work on.

Kenny Bailey (29:32.92)
Exactly.

Kenny Bailey (29:41.212)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (29:48.792)
So there's a little mental control as well of being aware of it will help that spike as well. Cause I'm aware of the stress in my life right now, which is quite, quite high. I eat, try to eat well, but I am craving all sorts of sweets. It's, it's driving me nuts. So.

Karelle (29:55.202)
that psychology.

Kenny Bailey (29:57.426)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (30:08.059)
Yeah, I mean, it's, I mean, you can draw a straight line between if I had a light lunch, really busy afternoon, it's getting towards the end. And then I go right and get grocery store chicken. Like it's, you know.

Karelle (30:08.493)
Meh.

Karelle (30:20.803)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (30:20.997)
that fried chicken from the grocery store, it's like you've got a hankering for it. It's like that's the thing that's going to do it because it seems like, is that a part of comfort I think for some people just because of based off of the idea that you do have a stress and that food acts as a comfort to kind of help reduce that stress or is it just, you know, like you said, it's a, your sweet response kicks in.

Coach Tom (30:21.515)
You

Coach Tom (30:24.961)
Yeah. Yeah.

Karelle (30:41.582)
It's really interesting. think it's two ways. think that neurotransmitter is sending a message. You need some quick sugar. You need something rewarding, something that kicks back on the dopamine response, right? It makes you feel a little bit more alert as well at that moment because that's what you need. Again, put yourself back into the wild. You need to be alert.

Kenny Bailey (31:05.531)
Yeah. Yeah.

Karelle (31:08.814)
So it's that continuous response. That's where I often hear, and you mentioned Ozempic, but when the whole Ozempic started talking about, I heard a lot of...

The willpower. Yes, but you need the willpower. It doesn't work like that. It's I wish it would be as simple as that. I wish I would have people and say, I found the key to open the willpower for every one of you. No, it's it works. It works for a small percentage of the population. Great. I'm so pleased for that. But that one percent. But the willpower is.

Coach Tom (31:30.669)
Wouldn't it?

Kenny Bailey (31:38.353)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Coach Tom (31:39.681)
Ha

Kenny Bailey (31:48.091)
Yeah. Yeah.

Coach Tom (31:49.581)
Yeah, that 1%. Yeah.

Karelle (31:54.802)
Driven by that stress response is driven by the environment like you mentioned Tom the stress that you are in It's driving all this distress response behind Making you more alert breaking down your sleep. If your sleep is not that deep It's going to be impacting your blood sugar response during the day, right? So it's not just when you go out and you don't sleep very well or when you jet lag that that blood response gonna be impacted by the sleep, right?

But it's for most of us, it's every day because of the job we have. Again, you know, it could be just the intensity of the job. It can be life at home. It can be the kids that are having, going through a lot and on top of the training. And I would often see sometimes that we are craving some kind of that training to answer that response that we have in the stress.

And it sometimes makes that even more powerful. I think I'm making back to a little bit of the topic you guys talk about with Sarah. And that just sometimes fuel in that even more, that aspect of, you know, we're digging a little bit further into that stress response as well. And it's really interesting how we just need to a step back and nurture the body more rather than just, you know.

Coach Tom (33:11.778)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (33:11.803)
Yep.

Kenny Bailey (33:17.884)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (33:20.589)
Wow, wow. So how do we tie the protein into this? Now we talked about balancing that out. How much protein is it? And what types of protein affect differently?

Karelle (33:20.962)
But it's really interesting topic.

Karelle (33:36.554)
Yeah, good question. With the protein that would really depends of again, what is the goal? What are we looking at? Is that I would use the protein in terms of modulating that body composition as well, but also with athletes that, you know, yeah, that blood sugar response. So plant-based or animal-based protein is a one of

them work and the point of view of supporting when we have a plant-based we discuss a little bit more that strategy of going with legumes and cereals together combined to really give you that full range of amino acid. So it's probably more of a quality versus quantity when it comes to plant-based because it's more difficult in terms of reaching that quantity per se. But we're really looking at the quality here.

it's interesting. often focus a lot on the protein, but vegetables would also bring that fullness as well. Right. And those fibers. So, so I don't necessarily just talk protein. I took everything at the same times around the meals to really bring it back to, because you can eat, you know, you can be eating 50 grams of protein and not lose weight because you simply missing so much more in your plate that in big. Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (34:42.833)
Mm-hmm.

Coach Tom (35:01.409)
Yeah, yeah, because so much on the internet, yeah, so much on the internet right now is just, you need to eat your protein, protein, protein, especially for us older guys that are trying to maintain some muscle mass. They're pushing big numbers on the amount of protein that we need to have. And it seems to be partially true. But once again, it seems to be taking it out of context of the rest of your meals and how you kind of get that.

Karelle (35:08.322)
Yeah.

Karelle (35:26.114)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (35:30.51)
protein and I think that's one of the struggles I've had is trying to figure out the amount of protein to eat and how to the best ways to get it and we we kind of touched on supplements a little bit but supplementation should be just that it shouldn't be your main go-to it should be in addition as a supplement and there's so much it's such an unregulated industry there's so much you can get the cheap supplements that they're loaded with all sorts of stuff that's not

Karelle (35:42.424)
in.

Coach Tom (35:59.992)
good for your body and like maybe you're in this cycle where it's not working and you're taking in your think you're eating right and you're adding all these supplements but you're still not getting the the results you want. It could be the the quality of the supplements that you're actually using will have an effect right? So that's that's something else to look to as well. It's yeah I don't think we're focused on looking at the bigger picture all the time.

Karelle (36:22.198)
Yes.

Karelle (36:26.06)
Remember that triangle we look at whole food and the supplements is just the supplements is on top It's just a complement to supplements. It's here to correct Deficiencies is here to bring a little bit extra when we are not quite there It needs to be you know the cherry on the cake and that's just not the bulk of your of your diet the bulk of the diet needs to come

from whole food, needs to come from vegetables, seasonal vegetables, I know we talked about that, it needs to come from diversity and it's regardless if we are athletes or if we are not athletes because this is really important. As athletes even more because we're using more nutrients, you're coming into the hopefully the summer season. So it's just still not happening.

Kenny Bailey (36:59.121)
Good.

Kenny Bailey (37:17.019)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (37:17.813)
It was 32 degrees this morning here in Tennessee. So it's just that we've had our last frost, hopefully. Yeah, he, yeah, it's cold.

Kenny Bailey (37:21.211)
Yeah, we don't know what that is in Celsius, but it's cold.

Karelle (37:22.082)
Yeah.

It's even for us in Portugal, it's been terrible. But hopefully that comes at some point. But you know, we sweat more, we have a higher demand, higher energy turnover, we have a higher need of antioxidant, antioxidant rather than taking supplementation, which it will help. But go for fruit and vegetables, go with leafy greens, have a beautiful salad. And that will do the job because you need that to just...

help with these free radicals from you know the energy production and we tend to focus that and we tend to forget and I often would hear What are the supplements I should take but let's bring it back to the food because your plates Will continue for years and years on and that will nourish your body all year round your supplements like you say Tom Often the questionable quality not all

I think it's really important to know that some of them are good quality, but they're much more expensive. So they're not necessarily the one, the go-to that often people would have. And I see when I recommend supplements, sometimes you're like, can I not get the cheaper one? You can, but I don't know what's in it. And you know, in terms of informed sports and athletes with...

Kenny Bailey (38:42.555)
Yep, a lot of fillers.

Coach Tom (38:42.583)
Yeah. Yeah.

Karelle (38:49.464)
with doping, a lot of athletes with doping is actually, some of them do dope, I'm not trying to say they're not, but a lot of the testing was done on athletes that were taking supplements and they don't know what's inside because when you test supplements and when you are buying supplements with those labels, there's a few labels, Informed Sports and et cetera, they will...

Coach Tom (38:56.173)
There's always, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Karelle (39:14.286)
say, well, in that magnesium you had taurine or you had this or you had that. So very quickly you just realize that you're actually taking things that you don't know what's inside, right? That regulation is not what we're expecting it to be. So whole food is always going to be the foundation and the base of the diet. Really, really important.

Coach Tom (39:36.299)
bass. Yeah. Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (39:37.65)
Yep. Yeah. I see, I see a lot of athletes, at least where I'm at, where prep meals are kind of a big deal, right? They just set up, you know, basically sweet potatoes and chicken or sweet potatoes and turkey burger. And that's it for lunch, like every day, all day. I'm assuming that's, that's okay, but hopefully the other meals there to, to your point supplement it with leafy greens and antioxidants and fruits. But you see refrigerator full of basically sweet potatoes and

Karelle (39:53.486)
Mm-hmm.

Karelle (40:02.723)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (40:06.759)
I believe it or not, I think we did a minor test. think we have 32 trainers. I think we we guessed between about 350 and 400 pounds of sweet potatoes a month these guys are consuming. It's just insane. Just nothing but sweet potatoes and turkey burger like every day all day. So it's insane.

Karelle (40:18.754)
Wow. Well, it's better that... Yeah.

Karelle (40:27.288)
Yeah.

think to that Kenny I have to say we all creature of habits and we tend to do that regularly to gravitate towards simplicity. Simplicity, exactly. And we tend to forget, you know, and even me for example I sometimes, I used to cook this, I haven't done it for a while. So it's just coming back to challenging ourselves with other foods and...

Kenny Bailey (40:37.154)
to make some publicity, right? Yeah, your life is very complex, and there are a lot of complex. If my prep meal's already taken care of, I'm done, right?

Kenny Bailey (40:50.972)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (40:57.509)
Yeah.

Karelle (40:58.656)
Lunchtime can be really tricky, especially for people who are having lunch somewhere and sometimes it has to be, you know, my children complains, are you always giving me wrap for lunch? I'm like, yes, but what else? So it's really, it's really complicated. I can't give you a avocado because it'd be black. So as long as you are able to have diversity in the other meals and the dinner, and that's where you can bring in

Kenny Bailey (41:03.589)
Yep.

Coach Tom (41:10.957)
That's all I got.

Kenny Bailey (41:16.199)
Sure.

Kenny Bailey (41:25.072)
Yeah.

Karelle (41:28.898)
more legumes, more vegetables, more fibers, diversity of meat as well. So protein is a plant-based or animal protein. That's where you can have more leafy greens. That would be really, really good. But you can still stay into the simplicity. And I think there's some comfort as well into being able to do your batch cooking and keep it simple, but diverse.

Kenny Bailey (41:41.467)
Yeah. Good.

Karelle (41:57.964)
Does it make sense? Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (41:58.118)
Yeah. No, it does, right? Just like you spend the Sunday, you know, basically doing the prep meals, but don't, it doesn't have to be the same. know, you don't cook, you know, pounds and pounds of chicken, you know, pounds and pounds of potatoes. And that's the only two things you have, right? It could be a variety of that stuff, but it's just interesting to see how habits form to your point where humans want to go towards simplicity, right? They want to go towards.

Coach Tom (41:59.406)
Yeah.

Karelle (42:09.142)
No, that's it. Yeah.

Karelle (42:20.13)
Yeah, we do.

Kenny Bailey (42:24.583)
Even the thing with Ozempic, even with the continuous glucose, the theme is like just tell me the two or three things, right? It's a complex web, but I just want one or two things to help me figure it out. So hopefully this thing will tell me, you know, don't do this or the Ozempic will help me, you know, get to that magical place where it's just, you one or two things and anything more than that and people tend to... Yeah. Exactly. Too much simplicity when you're trying to just say, you know, put a rainbow on your plate, call it a day.

Karelle (42:30.787)
Yeah.

Karelle (42:43.606)
and we tend to bring it back down to too much simplicity because... Simplicity is good.

Coach Tom (42:49.9)
Yeah.

Karelle (42:54.488)
For that, in terms of being challenged with the food, there's different ideas. You look at the... And it's funny, I was talking with a client yesterday. You go to the supermarket or you go to the market, but it's almost like we don't see 80 % of what's on offer. You look at exactly what you came to buy, right?

Kenny Bailey (42:54.725)
Yeah.

Karelle (43:17.292)
So you came to buy cucumber, but it could be anything around. You're not looking at it because you're like, God knows I'm not going to look at this. Certainly not look at it. And it's, it's, that's normal. I think that's because we like that. Again, we, we back to the gather and hunter. You are in the wild and you're looking for that type of food, right? So we keep doing that.

Coach Tom (43:17.558)
Uh-huh.

Karelle (43:40.448)
So challenge yourself different way. For me, I would have a list on the fridge sometimes and because I forget the meals that I saw, I make ratatouille, I make that, that, that. So I would come back, yeah, I forgot about that. You know, but it's crazy. Even you forget what you used to do a month, two months ago, three months ago. So challenge yourself and by writing them down, I have a nice kitchen now, but I used to take pictures and I had pictures of a scallop out of recipes because I was like, ooh, I want to do a pho.

Coach Tom (44:08.109)
There you go.

Karelle (44:10.39)
So I'm printing the fur and I have it on the kitchen counter, so I would come back to that. But challenge yourself into simplistic recipe, but that asks bringing you a diversity of food that you don't necessarily have. Simple, know, three, four ingredients, just really simple, but it's a good way to challenge yourself, looking at the season as well. Okay, right, this time of the year, we're gonna have more.

Coach Tom (44:13.965)
There you go.

Karelle (44:40.374)
We probably have very different selection with you and more courgettes coming on. We have more cabbage, et cetera, et cetera. What can we do? What can I cook with that? Because it's really important.

Coach Tom (44:52.853)
Yeah, I think finding those recipes is the challenge or finding those ideas. For us, it's like we're if we're tired, we're doing stuff, we have a set list for groceries. That's our staples, right? And and I can go in probably without the list and buy the same things I walk right up. I'm a great buyer. I'm a terrible shopper. So if I know if I have a list, I know what I'm getting. go in, I get that. I walk out. That's it. I'm not looking at anything else. Like you said, I've just I'm not.

Karelle (44:56.939)
Yeah.

Karelle (45:05.742)
That's it.

Hmm.

Karelle (45:17.784)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (45:20.481)
going like, well they have cabbage or they have, they've got this, why don't we try making something with this? We fall back into this thing where we get five items almost every single time. And then we come back and then we have these very simple meals because it's the same thing because this is all we can make with this at this point. We've kind of worn out our brains on that and we're trying, my wife's much better at it than I am at coming up with ideas or.

Karelle (45:20.92)
No.

Karelle (45:33.23)
Yeah.

Karelle (45:40.962)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (45:48.142)
recipes and things and let's go buy a few other things. There was a point, this was several years ago, where one of the local farms would do one of the CSA boxes, the farm box, where you would pay X amount and every week they would drop a box at your doorstep. You had no idea what was in it. It was whatever would come and that was probably the most interesting time we had because we would pull things up and we would have to

Karelle (45:51.49)
Yeah.

Karelle (46:03.36)
Mm-hmm.

Karelle (46:06.892)
Yeah. Yeah.

Coach Tom (46:17.867)
we would have to search, Google them, what is this? What is this vegetable? I've never seen this before. And then we would have to figure out ways to make something with it because we weren't throwing anything out. So it was the most challenging and interesting time we had cooking because we were forced into it. We've gotten away from that now and we probably need to figure out a way to get back into one of those farm box things that we can get on a weekly basis so we can go, okay, let's...

Karelle (46:21.739)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (46:46.679)
do something different to kind of keep it up because otherwise I'll just, go, I'm not very emotionally tied to food. I will go to whatever works and I will just stay with whatever works. I will eat that breakfast, lunch and dinner. I will eat the same meal every single time because I'll get the results I want out of it. But I really like to cook, but I just not, I'm not doing that side of it because it's too busy. We're too stressed and we're going through stuff. I mean, it's that coming up with interesting recipes and

Karelle (46:48.419)
Yeah.

Karelle (46:59.342)
Yeah.

Karelle (47:11.043)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (47:17.441)
Being creative about it, I think, is challenging.

Karelle (47:20.726)
Yeah, and that's really hard. It's really difficult to do that. bring some diversity, would say. you use maybe one vegetable or two vegetables, one legumes, and you just cook them together. And then that's one. And usually, it takes no time, right? So you could be having just to give a few ideas so then you can use them.

Andamame, I really like andamame. You can do andamame, chee ta ke together. That's really lovely. And you can have maybe a brocoli or something or baby spinach, you know, that you have to eat brilliant. That's done, right? It's one done. And then you can do two or three like that. So you like, suddenly you're coming from one vegetables, one grain and a big piece of meat to something a little bit more complex without taking too much of your time where you have.

Coach Tom (47:50.558)
Yeah.

Karelle (48:20.122)
diversity and I always look at you know when I work with clients and we do this work gradually when we look at the food and I always say you don't need to know what the nutrients or the vitamins are but think about the colors so think about a little bit of different colors one green one red one brown one orange for example so what are you missing when you see your plates

you could be, okay the green is the endamame, okay but maybe I'll have some cherry tomatoes so make sure there's always cherry tomatoes in the fridge. So on your list you add the cherry tomato, okay great, then you have the brown with the shiitake mushroom, great, that's you've got some colors here. Next day you can have shredded carrots, sometimes in the supermarket in the fresh section you will have some shredded carrots, they literally just fresh and shredded, that saves time when we don't have time, right?

Coach Tom (48:59.927)
Hmm.

Karelle (49:13.198)
It's great if you can shred them, but it takes a little bit more time. So get the shredded carrots. Okay, you can have a red cabbage. That takes no time.

it's much easier than the carrots you just slice it okay you turn that together brilliant that's another or you have that with your salad so you have a little bit of a little bit of baby spinach you've got your red cabbage you've got your shredded carrots you just need to add your chicken one or two tablespoons of rice that you have from the day before you have a nice salad so now you can add a couple of things you feeling confident into like

Coach Tom (49:24.909)
Yes.

Karelle (49:52.48)
things because you like suddenly wow I've made that great and well why don't I just add a bit of feta cheese to it because why not

Kenny Bailey (50:01.894)
Why not?

Coach Tom (50:02.125)
or not. Because it's cheese. Yeah.

Karelle (50:03.533)
a bit of olive oil and you're done. That's a really nice. But make sure there is that grain, is that protein and those grains, right? So we work a lot with the wellness plate, with the plate together with clients and then it comes in your head. It just kind of makes more sense when you put your plates together. Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (50:04.871)
There you go.

Coach Tom (50:25.749)
love that. That's perfect. Kenny, what are you gonna have for lunch today?

Kenny Bailey (50:30.047)
Chicken with the sweet potato You know, that's tomorrow yeah Thursdays is turkey Thursday, you know chicken Wednesday

Coach Tom (50:31.533)
And sweet potatoes.

Karelle (50:31.79)
and sweet potatoes. I thought it was turkey. diversity.

Coach Tom (50:37.133)
Diversity, yeah, that's tomorrow. We're gonna mix that up tomorrow. Carrell, you do a really good job on Instagram with throwing out some recipes once in a while. And we had a little chat about this before about being overwhelmed trying to find some of those stuff. But one of the ones that my wife and I tried, did, what was it? I had it written down here.

Karelle (50:56.728)
Thank you.

Karelle (51:05.294)
The cauliflower I'm gonna...

Coach Tom (51:06.925)
The cauliflower, yeah, cauliflower and egg breakfast muffins, which were really easy to make. And that was kind of fun for a little different because I usually have eggs for breakfast. I usually get that's my protein source for breakfast and go through. this occasionally we like to mix it up a little bit. This was one of them. So you should follow follow Corell on Instagram because she'll throw a couple of these out every once in a while. It's fun to make. In fact, we might even.

Karelle (51:13.773)
Yeah.

Karelle (51:19.736)
Yeah.

Karelle (51:29.304)
Thank you.

Coach Tom (51:33.542)
I might even show this in the show notes, the recipe for this one, just for a little something different. Like let's get our thinking caps on and get creative and that simple. I love how you broke that out for colors, because that's better. I've heard the of the color routine before, but not in the depths that you did, adding the browns onto it and adding some of the others. So I love that. I love that part of it. So this is fantastic. Terrell, this is great. I always love chatting with you.

Karelle (51:37.133)
that's really nice. Thanks.

Karelle (51:55.32)
Yeah. Yeah.

Karelle (52:00.662)
Yeah, and this... that's so sweet, thank you. And this little cauliflower, they're a little snack. These little... I mean, if I say cauliflower, it's not appealing for me. If I say those little egg muffins, they're much more appealing.

Coach Tom (52:08.386)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (52:11.633)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (52:12.509)
It's much more appealing. If you say muffin on something, it's always much better, right? Cauliflower muffin is okay. Cauliflower, not as, not a big selling point on that. Although we like roasted broccoli and roasted cauliflower is something that it'll be a staple. Well, I'll just, I'll cook up a bunch of it and then have it in the fridge. And then that just goes on the plate. If I need the vegetable, I'll just throw that on the plate.

Kenny Bailey (52:14.663)
There you go.

Kenny Bailey (52:18.151)
There you go.

Karelle (52:18.253)
Yeah.

Exactly.

Karelle (52:28.594)
it's really nice. Yeah.

Karelle (52:37.144)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (52:39.373)
because it's always good. You could throw some spicy seasonings on the cauliflower, it's always nice. It's your Nashville hot chicken flavoring on there. It's always good.

Karelle (52:43.49)
Yeah, absolutely.

Kenny Bailey (52:47.207)
There you go.

Karelle (52:50.156)
And that's so important because I think we all relate differently with what I call what's palatable to us, right? So for me, I grew up in France, if you haven't noticed, but I grew up where there's a lot of bread. So the crunchy is palatable to me, right?

Coach Tom (53:05.011)
Hehehehehe

Karelle (53:12.088)
For someone else, it can be the spices. For someone else, it can be, you know, that needs the rice. So when we are having a meal, there's a psychology, I think, behind that that is really important is you need to achieve that palatable moment in your dish. So if you are, if...

If your thing is the crunchiness for me if I don't have it I don't feel satisfied at end of my meal So if I have something that is too, you know vegetable soft, it doesn't feel like that So rather than going for a piece of bread five minutes later because I'm not feeling that satisfaction what I would do is I would have a couple of seeds on my salad and that gives me that crunchiness and And that's just really important to listen to what makes me kick in the way in my food, right?

Kenny Bailey (54:02.908)
Yep.

Karelle (54:03.184)
And for you it could be the spices, right? So make this, add these spices to your vegetables because if you don't have this, then you're gonna go into the fridge and get this chicken with the spices later or get something else that's going to bring you that satisfaction. So you're having a further food but your body doesn't need more food. It just needs that palatable satisfaction, right?

Coach Tom (54:03.575)
Mm-hmm.

Coach Tom (54:20.962)
Huh.

Coach Tom (54:27.819)
Yeah. Hi, interesting, because I've never even considered that on there. My growing up was, my mom cooked a lot, but she didn't cook very well. And then we got into a whole period of time where it was the Hungry Man frozen dinners, which have no nutritional significance whatsoever. It's just a frozen dinner with a plastic wrap on it. It's probably done us more damage than anything else. Horrible food, absolutely horrible food. So I look for different.

Kenny Bailey (54:32.859)
Yeah.

Karelle (54:48.344)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (54:50.213)
Yeah.

Coach Tom (54:57.451)
I like to mix up stuff quite a bit. So sometimes it's spicy, sometimes it's crunchy, whatever. I'm all over the map on food for that. But that's interesting to know that I think when I have my next meals, I'm gonna be thinking about that of like how that made me feel and what I'm missing from it. maybe it is more of a crunchy basis, or is it more of a spicy basis? I'm definitely gonna key in on that because that's interesting to me. That's really...

Karelle (55:02.563)
Yeah.

Karelle (55:13.634)
Think about that.

Karelle (55:17.838)
and what you miss.

Karelle (55:23.523)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (55:26.225)
Yep.

Coach Tom (55:26.337)
That's really intriguing.

Karelle (55:27.31)
Yeah, and you know, I worked with a lot of clients in Asia. They always have the the broth base as well. So we keep that because that's also really important. But I think sometimes when clients are going through their journey of nutrition, often have the, but should I eat that? Because I don't know if it's good for me.

Coach Tom (55:34.701)
Okay.

Karelle (55:49.602)
But that's really important to stick to what you have been also brought up with in the good way. I'm not going to eat bread all the time. It was bread, cheese and sausage. So imagine.

Coach Tom (55:57.313)
In a good way.

Kenny Bailey (56:02.459)
There you go.

Coach Tom (56:02.539)
Yeah, life was good. Outstanding. cool. Karel, thank you so much. We really appreciate having you on. We managed to figure out the time change and get in here so that we're not, we're sort of awake and you're in the middle of your day having hopefully a wonderful day and we appreciate everything. So everybody, if you've got questions, comments, send them to us.

Karelle (56:05.614)
You

Karelle (56:12.056)
Thank you.

Kenny Bailey (56:13.435)
Yeah.

Kenny Bailey (56:18.107)
There we go.

Coach Tom (56:29.993)
If you want to know more, we want to have Correll back on again. So we're going to have a Friends of the Podcast group that we want Correll to be a part of so we can answer some questions. So if you've got stuff nutrition-wise, send some questions. Certainly go check out her website and her Instagram. I'll put those in the show notes. And then make sure you subscribe. Subscribe to the podcast. You're on YouTube if you're watching us. You see our smiling faces.

Or if you're listening to us, you know, please thumbs up five stars all the all the ratings whatever you've got that gets the it gets us up higher in the algorithm and moves us around so Once again everybody Kenny Correll. Thank you so much And for everybody. Yep for everybody. We'll we'll catch you on the next one

Kenny Bailey (57:13.297)
Thanks, Kro.

Karelle (57:13.582)
Thank for having me.

Karelle (57:19.48)
Thank you, bye.